I remember tuning in to WPIX games when we first got cable and hearing Rizzuto off and on (I remember him calling the middle third of the game for some reason) and his repartee with Bill White ("White"). It was from Rizzuto that I first learned that many Italians' last names end in a vowel (he pointed this out repatedly). He was a character and will be missed.

David, this site, which uses the Thorn-Palmer numbers, agrees with you that Rizzuto doesn't belong in the HOF:

http://mysite.verizon.net/vze2x57w/sabermetrics/id1.html

But it's close. Rizzuto's 18.7 rating is far from terrible. He's better than several other shortstops in the Hall, and a bunch of players at other positions.

The numbers produce all sorts of interesting arguments. Bagwell rates exceptionally high among first basemen - third all time. That park adjustment for the Astrodome helps. But his career ended so badly that I bet he gets the Santo snub. His running-mate Biggio will almost certainly get in with the 3,000 hits, and he's deserving enough but not nearly as much as Bagwell.

Tenace and Munson rate very high among catchers, but neither has a chance. Piazza and Rodriguez are locks among the backstops, though.

Bobby Grich has always been a sabermetric favorite, but he's a hopeless case. The era he played through dulled his stats too much. Blyleven should get in, and maybe the memory of that curveball will get him there eventually.

And, of course, there's Santo himself - perhaps the most inexplicable HOF snub ever.

Interesting, Casey. According to that list Scooter is slightly better than Pee Wee, who went in a decade before him. And even though the HoF has to go with what guys did, it seems somewhat unfair that some players lost a few years due to war (injuries are part of the game, but geopolitical events aren't).

My guess is that Reese got in because of the Beloved Bums effect. The ultimate literary monument to the glorification of the Jackie Robinson Dodgers is, of course, Boys of Summer. Reese was a key component of that team, and the writers loved him (deservedly) for helping Robinson get into the league.

Rizzuto was part of the hated Yankees - see Boys of Summer for some amusing Yank-hatred. He didn't help any black players get into the league because the hated Bombers didn't have any back then.

Wonder if Barry Larkin will ever get in. He clearly deserves it, but the only Reds shortstop anybody ever seems to mention for the Hall is Concepcion, who wasn't nearly as good.

It's no surprise that Jeter is nowhere on the sabermetric list. The stat guys think he's way overrated. But the writers love him, so he's a first-ballot lock.

Jeter is 4-5 below average seasons from 3000 hits, I can't see him missing from this point, even with a career ending injury. My bet when it comes time for the current class of shortstops to get decided on Jeter and Arod will go in, garcipiarra and tejada will be no where to be found, remember that list is already a year and a half old there casey.

Besides, this is about Phil. As another person who grew up on scooter calling games, he goes to the hall on announcing alone. Throw in his playing contribution and he is a lock. Good job hall voters...

If you did not listen to him on the radio or TV, check out O holy Cow for a great book of excerpts of the Scooters calls presented in free form verse.

No possible way Jeter, Arod, Tejada ever eclipse him in the announcers booth. He will be missed.

Agreed that Jeter will go in, regardless of what the stat guys say. In fact, the writers will probably be especially happy to put him in, to show they aren't biased against the hated Yankees.

And the intelligent and affable Jeter probably is the best representative to the media that the hated Yanks could have. Don't get me wrong - a lot of sportswriters still have it in for the Yankees. Just ask A-Rod. But Jeter seems to be the Great Exception for media people.

I remember a funny conversation in a Twins game I watched on mlb.com. Bremer and Blyleven got to talking about the Yankees, though I don't think the Twins were actually playing against them. Bremer tried to convince Blyleven that Jeter represented the "good side" of the Bombers.

Blyleven didn't sound completely convinced. But enough media types like Jeter to get him into the Hall with zero trouble.

In his book "Whatever Happened to the Hall of Fame?" Bill James devotes quite a bit of time to the Rizzuto debate. The short version: Rizzuto was great at his peak, but had a very brief peak. Reese was a substantially better player. Rizzuto's elevation to the Hall was partly about his playing skills, and partly about his fame as a broadcaster in New York. He's not the worst player in the HOF, but he's definitely marginal.

A few Reese/Rizzuto comparisons, Reese listed first:

Games played: 2166/1661

Hits: 2170/1588

Runs: 1338/877

RBI: 885/563

HR: 126/38

Walks: 1210/651

SB/CS: 232/45 for Reese, 149/58 for Rizzuto

Also, while Rizzuto did win an MVP and finished second another year, he had only three top-10 finishes. Reese was in the top 10 eight times.

Rizzuto did lose three peak seasons to World War Two, but so did Reese. Rizzuto was a great player and a great broadcaster; his HOF credentials are better as a broadcaster.

Two things: park adjustments and defensive stats. Ebbets Field was great for all hitters. Ask Sandy Koufax. Or look at Koufax's numbers at Ebbets compared to Dodger Stadium. Yankee Stadium, especially pre-renovation, was death on right-handed batsmen. IIRC, James himself made a lot about this in his writeup on DiMaggio.

I don't have the Thorn-Palmer defensive numbers in front of me. But they tend to swing a shortstop's evaluation a lot, simply because the position is so crucial. I'll check how they rate Rizzuto and Reese.

Of course, all this is irrelevant to why Reese went into the Hall before the Scooter. The writers think the stat guys are full of it. They pay little or no attention to what James and other sabermetricians say about players.

Instead, writers like Roger Kahn, author of Boys of Summer, were very very happy to put their Beloved Bum Reese into the HOF. Rizzuto, well, they put him in once the memory of the uniform he wore had faded a little.

Some memories at the Baltimore Sun along with links to a couple of clips of Scooter including a discussion of his appearance on Meatloaf's Paradise by the Dashboard Light.

I'm now looking at the full 2001 Thorn-Palmer evaluation of Reese vs. Rizzuto. The overall ratings for the players changed little from 2001 to 2005. Phil has the edge on Pee Wee in both years.

The two players actually start with similar career batting lines: .269/.366/.377 for Reese vs. .273/.351/.355 for Rizzuto. After park and era adjustments, Reese gets a +21 batter rating, which is actually very good for a shortstop. Rizzuto gets a -44, which is not terrible for a shortstop.

But it gets real, real bad for Pee Wee on the defensive side. Thorn and Palmer rip him as actually below average as a fielder, with a -25 rating. Meanwhile, Rizzuto gets big hugs and kisses for his glove, with a +86 number. That really swings their evaluation in Phil's favor.

Was there actually that much difference between the two in the field? Well, I dunno. Both these gentlemen were slightly before this baby boomer's time. I was born in 1951 and didn't start paying attention to baseball until, oh, 1952.

As I recall from dim memory, Reese was never highly regarded for his glove work. Even the Dodger-adoring Boys of Summer doesn't rhapsodize about Pee Wee's glove, as the book does with Billy Cox and Carl Furillo. Rizzuto, on the famous other hand, does seem to have always enjoyed a good defensive rep.

Any defensive evaluation has its critics. Bill James, for instance, caught unholy hell for his range factors. But if you're wondering why Rizzuto tops Reese in the Thorn-Palmer ratings, well, now you know.

By the way, I have to temper one thing I said. Both Reese and Rizzuto were elected by the Veterans Committee. The writers passed on both. Still, I think Reese's role on the Jackie Robinson team - much glorified by sportswriters like Roger Kahn - helped him plenty.

Wikipedia says it took a determined campaign by Yankee fans to get Rizzuto into the Hall, which I can well believe. At any rate, I doubt that many of the people who evaluated either player for the Hall paid any attention to sabermetric analysis.

In addition to the Scooter nickname, NY Daily News Yanks beat writer, Joe Trimble, called Rizzuto "The Flea" for his short stature.
Phil & Dom DiMaggio were the best leadoff men & bunters in the AL in the 40s, early 50s. In spring training their respective fields had 3 ft diam circles painted halfway btwn pitcher's mound and the baseline and both would place bunt after bunt into those circles in practice & the pitches were not soft.
Rizzuto did not have a strong arm, but he would glide twd 3rd & nab grounders & quickly release rainbow throws to 1st that would almost always just nip batter/runners. He didn't dive at balls but could cover short outfield popups with the best. He & Tom Henrich in RF had a patent play with runners on 1/2 & 0/1 out and a medium fly to RF would be trapped by Henrich and thrown to Phil in the baseline btwn 2 & 3 & Phil would tag the belated runner going to 3 & then either sprint to 2B to force the runner from 1st or toss to the 2B for the force & a DP.
Rizzuto peaked with a MVP in 1950 but faded badly in the mid-50s. In contrast, Bklyn Pee Wee Reese kept up his steady play for many more years & Bill James calls Reese the best leadoff SS ever. James also calls Johnny Pesky as good leadoff SS as Reese, but Pesky was always No 2 batter behind Dom. Cards SS Marty Marion was a better fielder than Rizzuto & Reese but never got ink in mid-West tho he was NL 1944 MVP.
No one remembers that Yanks actually traded Rizzuto to Cards in 1956 and Phil sadly retired.